Curse

the savage nornbear · Aug 22, 2008, 10:44 PM // 22:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by RPGmaniac

Wow I had never heard of that before. Our school made us stand up and say the pledge in elementary. But I suppose if the kid cares enough to go to the Supreme Court he'll win. But it seems like less effort to stand for 30 seconds and mouth the words.

RPGmaniac · Aug 22, 2008, 11:00 PM // 23:00

The fact that the OP used the word "fascist" all but guaranteed that Hitler would come up eventually, hehe.

Our school is split into a freshman/sophomore campus and a junior/senior campus (high school). While I was a freshman and sophomore pretty much everybody stood. There were those couple of kids that for whatever reason didn't stand. Now that I'm at the junior/senior campus, the majority of the kids don't stand. And out of those who do, maybe 1 or 2 people actually SAY the pledge. We all laugh at that person too lol.

I don't even really know if we were forced to say the pledge in elementary/middle school either. We all just kinda did it...

lakatz · Aug 22, 2008, 11:16 PM // 23:16

I have a question that was posed on a similar topic in the past. Do children actually have 1st Amendment rights? Or are those rights limited to adults?

The conclusion in the past discussion on the similar subject was that, aside from rights extended through legislation designed to define things like child labor and child abuse/neglect, children are limited to the rights (and responsibilities) granted by their parents.

I'd love if anyone who has or will research this particular question would post links to relevant articles here.

Thanks.

Snow Bunny · Aug 22, 2008, 11:17 PM // 23:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by lakatz

I have a question that was posed on a similar topic in the past. Do children actually have 1st Amendment rights? Or are those rights limited to adults?

If they're citizens, they have the same rights except as explicitly stated otherwise.

RPGmaniac · Aug 22, 2008, 11:23 PM // 23:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by lakatz

I have a question that was posed on a similar topic in the past. Do children actually have 1st Amendment rights? Or are those rights limited to adults?

The conclusion in the past discussion on the similar subject was that, aside from rights extended through legislation designed to define things like child labor and child abuse/neglect, children are limited to the rights (and responsibilities) granted by their parents.

I'd love if anyone who has or will research this particular question would post links to relevant articles here.

Thanks.

14th amendment:

Quote:

Originally Posted by The 14th Amendment

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Bolded are what answers your question

lakatz · Aug 23, 2008, 12:32 AM // 00:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

If they're citizens, they have the same rights except as explicitly stated otherwise.

Actually, I just learned from a friend at work that if you're arrested and under 18 the police don't read you your Miranda Rights because you have no rights. EDIT: I just researched that further and learned it was changed in a 2007 court ruling and now only six states have a parent-must-be-present situation.

Then there are court rulings where 1st Amendment rights are protected in classrooms. Interesting. Does anyone understand the distinction?

RPG... thanks for the quote, but what you've quoted does not explicitly or implicity include children under 18. A definition of citizen might clarify that though. Anyone?

EDIT: I just found an interesting article asking if children are citizens. http://www.allacademic.com/meta/p_ml...479_index.html.

Kanyatta · Aug 23, 2008, 12:41 AM // 00:41

The question was answered within 3 posts, yet the topic continues on like a raving mountain lion. How I love thee Off-Topic & the Absurd!

lakatz · Aug 23, 2008, 01:26 AM // 01:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanyatta

The question was answered within 3 posts, yet the topic continues on like a raving mountain lion. How I love thee Off-Topic & the Absurd!

No it wasn't... unless you're not very discerning... so maybe it was for you... but it wasn't for me... I don't just accept everything I read written by just any one.

For one thing, I'm well aware that "law" is never cut-and-dry or black-and-white. It never has been, never will be. The 'law' is riddled with contradictions. It always has been, always will be. In some cultures it's very important to debate law exhaustively. In ancient Israel it was called pilpul. That's why there have been legal debates and legal battles 'raging' in courts and legal precedents set one after the other for thousands of years now.

You want to talk about legal questions being debated? Look at Roe vs Wade. That was originally decided in 1973... but the decision has been questioned continously since.